28 replies to this topic

[margateshot]

I posted on here last week how good the choir were against Lewes.  Well sorry, but this week they have let themselves, and the club down.

It was totally unacceptable to make Nazi and anti semetic chants today towards the CAFC goalkeeper today.  What was just as disgraceful were the chants against the Margate board, particularly Cliff Egan, who had the bottle to  go and challenge them at half time and tell them to stop.  The club could easily get a fine or worse for that behaviour if Carshalton complain.  Some of them need to grow up and be very careful what they say or do at these matches.   No doubt one of them will make some sort of comment on here and tell me get a life, well I do have one, and it needed saying.

[Coffin Ender]

All I heard was the "five German bombers" song. Anyway, good turnout, 70 or so. A game we should have won based on the first half performance alone. Game changed when they brought McDonald on 15-20 minutes from the end. The teams directly above us didn't seem to do so well so not too much damage done.

[Boney Crisp]

Are you really moaning about the Nazi's being seen in a bad light?? And also how can you be anti-semetic towards someone who is jokingly being put down as a Nazi??

This banter (and it is banter) between English and Germans has been going on for years, it's a rivalry and like all rivalries it's about bragging rights and WWII is the only thing we can brag about. If the keeper is seriously offended by this then I'm surprised he hasn't given up football and I'll be very surprised if he is offended and I'll be surprised if any German is offended by being called a Nazi.

Now obviously I wasn't there but I know the lads a lot better then what you do and they are all intelligent and well humoured lads and unlike many supporters we come across at this level they are fully aware on where to draw the line. Neither will we ever tell you to get a life, you could have said something in person to them (not aggresively) but instead you decide to say something on here on the WORLD WIDE WEB, thats going to do wonders for the clubs reputation and the supporters. If you talk to us we will talk back.

As for the chants against the board I'm at a complete lost on that, but I am 100% sure it would not be for no reason whatsoever.

[GEEBEE]

thats football, to many do gooders ruining a good vent of british humour.i think the p.c brigade has done more damage to this country than any thing else!!!

[JohnKirby]

I heard it yesterday. Personally I wouldn't sing songs like about the war, because I wasn't there, and so many people died. With things like this I think its personal taste, some don't find it offensive, some choose just to not involve themselves, and some will be offended. I think in cases like this, if someone asks you to stop, you should probably respect that and find something else to sing about, like how he won them the game yesterday!

[Dutch_Mike]

I've got so used to moronic comments about the choir on here (and, in all honesty, it's water off a duck's back most of the time), but this has got to be the most ridiculous yet. None of our songs were pro-Nazi or anti-Semitic - the complete opposite, in fact. I'm only clarifying this because, although most people's opinion of us is not always the best, I'm actually insulted to be labelled with such a damaging tag.

I suggest you either invest in a dictionary or get your facts right before you make such slanderous comments.

As for the issue with the board, on reflection, I personally think both parties could have acted differently (us and the board). But, ultimately, it was only a storm in a teacup, and I'm sure neither side will lose sleep over it.

[Porka]

Just the latest in a long line of ridiculous accusations levelled against "the choir".

Frankly, the comment by a certain board member "we'll have to chuck you out if we hear anymore swearing", was bordering on ludicrous. The Carshalton stewards were more interested in goading the away support than doing anything about any petty swearing.

[AncientBlue]

It strikes me that the only morons at the game yesterday were the so call ''choir'' Now the new songs about our team were very good, I liked those, but the ludicrous ridicule of their keeper throughout the game (Calling him a Nazi, and reference to Auschwitz in the same chorus as Hitler) to a lad who wasn't born until probably 40 years later was totally out of order. Don't say it didn't happen, it did . . . and I'm not quoting it out of context either. There were families there with young children having to listen to a barage of offensive bad language which exceeded your normal output of verbal excretions.

To cap it all, when Cliff Egan requested that you tone it down for the second half at the request of our opponents management . . . the result was that he walked away to a BARAGE OF F**K OFF EGAN, F**K OFF EGAN . . . (again, who were  the morons)?

Now I no doubt will get an equally abusive reply to this, but honestly GROW UP FOR GOD'S SAKE!

[Boney Crisp]

Why do people insist on making us out to be someone who we are not, giving us the supporters a bad name. It just seems that people think that the atmosphere at a football match should be equivalent to that of a bowls match. You get swearing and always will do and has always been there and the sooner people realise that the sooner we can move on from this pathetic argument. If you don't like hearing naughty words then why did you ever go to a football match, or even leave your house for that matter? I hear swearing all the time at midday when watching football on the tele, no one moans about that. People don't like it when we don't sing and when we do eveyone is quick to mute us.

AB your comment of telling us to grow up is probably the least productive thing you could say. We are not little kids with no intelligence, far from it, but because we get segregated no one knows that. We don't appreciate being spoken down to by a number of our own supporters either. We are fully aware that their keeper isn't a nazi and like I said it's not like we are pro-nazi and anything we sing isn't pro-nazi. We call the Schulz brothers Nazi's all the time and no one has ever said anything, neither is it actually offensive, however people think it should be offensive.

AncientBlue, on 29 January 2012 - 01:08 PM, said:

It strikes me that the only morons at the game yesterday were the so call ''choir'' Now the new songs about our team were very good, I liked those, but the ludicrous ridicule of their keeper throughout the game (Calling him a Nazi, and reference to Auschwitz in the same chorus as Hitler) to a lad who wasn't born until probably 40 years later was totally out of order. Don't say it didn't happen, it did . . . and I'm not quoting it out of context either. There were families there with young children having to listen to a barage of offensive bad language which exceeded your normal output of verbal excretions.

To cap it all, when Cliff Egan requested that you tone it down for the second half at the request of our opponents management . . . the result was that he walked away to a BARAGE OF F**K OFF EGAN, F**K OFF EGAN . . . (again, who were  the morons)?

Now I no doubt will get an equally abusive reply to this

Now read your last sentance and then realise how hypocritical and patronising you have been towards us.

[Pat the Shark]

It was my first away game today and I had a great day out with "the choir" as you so dub.

I was also there at half time when, and I quote from (I believe Cliff Egan), "we've had some complaints from the CAFC directors about the language, this is a family club and they would like to keep it that way." - was presented to us. OK, no problem. subsequently, for the next 45 minutes of football, no bad/foul language was uttered.
However, I link here to a selection of video's from the CAFC, which some may find offensive; http://forums.footba...7&article=23656


As for the "It was totally unacceptable to make Nazi and anti Semitic chants today towards the CAFC goalkeeper today." comment, lets review;

1. Antisemitism (also spelled anti-semitism or anti-Semitism) is suspicion of, hatred toward, or discrimination against Jews for reasons connected to their Jewish heritage. - learn what words mean before you use them.

2. A nazi chant would infer support of the nazi party. - again grossly incorrect, again, meanings of words are important.


Finally, I had a fantastic day out supporting my local team, I would love to come and see the boys in blue play again asap!

However I feel the treatment today was, to say the least, insulting. 'margateshot' - almost everything you have said in your original post is incorrect, I feel offended that as a new supporter, willing to travel to away games to give my support, you so happily alienate anyone who has a difference of opinion on a situation/subject matter/day out supporting our local team. I put it to you that in fact, you are a Xenophobe, a person who has "an unreasonable fear of foreigners or strangers or of that which is foreign or strange." - You in fact hold the prejudice not us, we congratulated the keeper on his fantastic game immediately after the match, he nodded his approval, somehow I feel this will not be the case here.

As for the latest comment of chants about "f**k off egan" - 100% incorrect, as after our warning from Mr Egan (apparently from CAFC), we didn't utter a swear word in the second half. Unlike (as video evidence proves) the actual CAFC supporters.

End of the day, we were behind the team all game, all day and still are. That won't change.

[Frankie100]

Boney Crisp, on 29 January 2012 - 03:56 PM, said:

Why do people insist on making us out to be someone who we are not, giving us the supporters a bad name. It just seems that people think that the atmosphere at a football match should be equivalent to that of a bowls match. You get swearing and always will do and has always been there and the sooner people realise that the sooner we can move on from this pathetic argument. If you don't like hearing naughty words then why did you ever go to a football match, or even leave your house for that matter? I hear swearing all the time at midday when watching football on the tele, no one moans about that. People don't like it when we don't sing and when we do eveyone is quick to mute us.

AB your comment of telling us to grow up is probably the least productive thing you could say. We are not little kids with no intelligence, far from it, but because we get segregated no one knows that. We don't appreciate being spoken down to by a number of our own supporters either. We are fully aware that their keeper isn't a nazi and like I said it's not like we are pro-nazi and anything we sing isn't pro-nazi. We call the Schulz brothers Nazi's all the time and no one has ever said anything, neither is it actually offensive, however people think it should be offensive.

AncientBlue, on 29 January 2012 - 01:08 PM, said:

It strikes me that the only morons at the game yesterday were the so call ''choir'' Now the new songs about our team were very good, I liked those, but the ludicrous ridicule of their keeper throughout the game (Calling him a Nazi, and reference to Auschwitz in the same chorus as Hitler) to a lad who wasn't born until probably 40 years later was totally out of order. Don't say it didn't happen, it did . . . and I'm not quoting it out of context either. There were families there with young children having to listen to a barage of offensive bad language which exceeded your normal output of verbal excretions.

To cap it all, when Cliff Egan requested that you tone it down for the second half at the request of our opponents management . . . the result was that he walked away to a BARAGE OF F**K OFF EGAN, F**K OFF EGAN . . . (again, who were  the morons)?

Now I no doubt will get an equally abusive reply to this

Now read your last sentance and then realise how hypocritical and patronising you have been towards us.

Hypocritical NO Patronising Probably but then again it is necessary as whenever this issue appear certain members of the choir think they have done nothing wrong.

When those of us in the choir of the late 1970s/1980s sang there was no need for swear words and and yes we all knew certain people swore at matches but didnt actually feel the need to join in

[dannyriding]

Pat the Shark, on 29 January 2012 - 04:05 PM, said:

It was my first away game today and I had a great day out with "the choir" as you so dub.

I was also there at half time when, and I quote from (I believe Cliff Egan), "we've had some complaints from the CAFC directors about the language, this is a family club and they would like to keep it that way." - was presented to us. OK, no problem. subsequently, for the next 45 minutes of football, no bad/foul language was uttered.
However, I link here to a selection of video's from the CAFC, which some may find offensive; http://forums.footba...7&article=23656


As for the "It was totally unacceptable to make Nazi and anti Semitic chants today towards the CAFC goalkeeper today." comment, lets review;

1. Antisemitism (also spelled anti-semitism or anti-Semitism) is suspicion of, hatred toward, or discrimination against Jews for reasons connected to their Jewish heritage. - learn what words mean before you use them.

2. A nazi chant would infer support of the nazi party. - again grossly incorrect, again, meanings of words are important.


Finally, I had a fantastic day out supporting my local team, I would love to come and see the boys in blue play again asap!

However I feel the treatment today was, to say the least, insulting. 'margateshot' - almost everything you have said in your original post is incorrect, I feel offended that as a new supporter, willing to travel to away games to give my support, you so happily alienate anyone who has a difference of opinion on a situation/subject matter/day out supporting our local team. I put it to you that in fact, you are a Xenophobe, a person who has "an unreasonable fear of foreigners or strangers or of that which is foreign or strange." - You in fact hold the prejudice not us, we congratulated the keeper on his fantastic game immediately after the match, he nodded his approval, somehow I feel this will not be the case here.

As for the latest comment of chants about "f**k off egan" - 100% incorrect, as after our warning from Mr Egan (apparently from CAFC), we didn't utter a swear word in the second half. Unlike (as video evidence proves) the actual CAFC supporters.

End of the day, we were behind the team all game, all day and still are. That won't change.

The court rests your honour - underline said incident now and look forward to the next game

[Boney Crisp]

Frankie100, on 29 January 2012 - 04:17 PM, said:

Boney Crisp, on 29 January 2012 - 03:56 PM, said:

Why do people insist on making us out to be someone who we are not, giving us the supporters a bad name. It just seems that people think that the atmosphere at a football match should be equivalent to that of a bowls match. You get swearing and always will do and has always been there and the sooner people realise that the sooner we can move on from this pathetic argument. If you don't like hearing naughty words then why did you ever go to a football match, or even leave your house for that matter? I hear swearing all the time at midday when watching football on the tele, no one moans about that. People don't like it when we don't sing and when we do eveyone is quick to mute us.

AB your comment of telling us to grow up is probably the least productive thing you could say. We are not little kids with no intelligence, far from it, but because we get segregated no one knows that. We don't appreciate being spoken down to by a number of our own supporters either. We are fully aware that their keeper isn't a nazi and like I said it's not like we are pro-nazi and anything we sing isn't pro-nazi. We call the Schulz brothers Nazi's all the time and no one has ever said anything, neither is it actually offensive, however people think it should be offensive.

AncientBlue, on 29 January 2012 - 01:08 PM, said:

It strikes me that the only morons at the game yesterday were the so call ''choir'' Now the new songs about our team were very good, I liked those, but the ludicrous ridicule of their keeper throughout the game (Calling him a Nazi, and reference to Auschwitz in the same chorus as Hitler) to a lad who wasn't born until probably 40 years later was totally out of order. Don't say it didn't happen, it did . . . and I'm not quoting it out of context either. There were families there with young children having to listen to a barage of offensive bad language which exceeded your normal output of verbal excretions.

To cap it all, when Cliff Egan requested that you tone it down for the second half at the request of our opponents management . . . the result was that he walked away to a BARAGE OF F**K OFF EGAN, F**K OFF EGAN . . . (again, who were  the morons)?

Now I no doubt will get an equally abusive reply to this

Now read your last sentance and then realise how hypocritical and patronising you have been towards us.

Hypocritical NO Patronising Probably but then again it is necessary as whenever this issue appear certain members of the choir think they have done nothing wrong.

When those of us in the choir of the late 1970s/1980s sang there was no need for swear words and and yes we all knew certain people swore at matches but didnt actually feel the need to join in

He was calling us morons whilst claiming that we are offensive, so to me that is being hypocritical.

I find it hard to believe that there was no swearing at Hartsdown during the 70's/80's a period where racism and chair throwing was mandatory

I get annoyed when people say "no swearing we are a family club" obviously that is done so youngsters keep turning up to football, something which has never been a problem and what I do find interesting is that people have started to stop going to football matches because impulsive behaviour has been banned.

[JohnKirby]

There definitely was some anti Egan shouting yesterday. "[****!!****] off egan" was repeated. That in itself I find unacceptable for all he has done for the club. This is the fickle side of football, and given reflection maybe the supporters should apologise for that.

[hangthedj]

I think you'll find that what was being sung was 'SHARK off Egan', which was our light hearted retort to being told to keep the swearing down, which we did. Replacing swearing with the word shark seemed to work rather well actually.

[JohnKirby]

right you are, sorry I heard you wrong. good to see you yesterday.

[Joseba]

I must say it was nice to see the Leicester branch of Margate Football Club in attendance yesterday.



PS to the choir Carshalton is a small town in ROUNDSHAW not Sutton.

Edited by Joseba, 29 January 2012 - 07:17 PM.

[hangthedj]

Always good to have the Leicester boys back on the terraces

[blueblood]

I believe Auschwitz was mentioned during the choirs performance. Auschwitz is I  believe,in Poland not Germany.
Friday was Also Holocaust Day. A day to commemorate a period when at least one of our staunch supporters lost the majority of his family to the camps.

[margateshot]

In reply to some of the comments, lets clear some things up.

Last week I praised the choir oh here after the Lewes match for their enthusiasm and support.  So to say that people are continually critising them is a bit harsh.  You are very popular with other supporters both home and away when you are at your best, but it only you yourselves who let the choir down.   As for the "Anti Censorship Brigade" ?   

To say that its a football match, and swearing is part of it is correct.  However in Non league ground the swearing can be heard more clearly with less people in the ground.  Therfore is it acceptable?  No it is not, is it tolerated probably yes.  There is a difference.

Canvey Island supporters were at Hartsdown a few weeks ago and sang througout, and at no time was anything offensive said.

As for Anti semetic chants/shouts, you may like to argue what anti semetic is and quote the correct meaning.  However when at a football match and the words Nazi, Goering and Aushwitz are mentioned at the same time, directed at the opposition goalkeeper, the only purpose it has is to cause offence, therefore it does become an issue.  On the subject of quoting the correct meaning of terms, take a look at what is a racial comment.  A comment is racial if that comment is percieved to be racial, by ANYBODY present at the time.

When a number of Gate fans comment on her that they thought it was offensive, or plainly out of order, then there is credence in the argument.  When the opposition directors make comment to it, and ask the Gate directors to say something it has even more credence.  The only time that the goalkeper reacted to your comments was when he turned around after the Aushwitz comments and said  "Whats your problem?".  So can everybody be wrong?

Theres probably other people on here that may wish to comment but believe they cannot due to people knowing each other on this board.  I certainly spoke to others.


As for the second half, yes the swearing was toned down, but why then have a go at the board, especially Cliff Egan who was acting on behalf of the club.  There was somebody in the choir who tried to start a chant of "Egan is a Paedophile" at one point, but was rightly stopped by others. Is that the behaviour of mature adults that you proclaim to be.  The chanting against Cliff was so much at one point that I honestly believed I'd missed something in the local papers.  That was totally un-called for, particularly as a number of the board and staff were standing behind the goal.  After recent events I would be interested in how you can justify those remarks.

All said and done, I hope the choir continue to make a contribution to the support of this club.

As stated before, this is a forum and people are entitled to comment on here, and I hope my comments are taken in the manner they are meant, for the benefit of MARGATE FOOTBALL CLUB.

Edited by margateshot, 30 January 2012 - 05:10 PM.